How Self-Awareness Impacts Financial Health and Relationships

Liz Hand [00:00:00]:
Because money is is like blood in a body, like it connects all parts and its health matters. Therefore, the advisor that's taking care of the person with the money, if they're more self aware and they allow their clients to become more self aware, then it's just allowing for family relationships to expand, community relationships to expand, the purpose of money to be less about consumerism and more about goodness. So I get really excited about all of the ripple effects for sure.

Joanna Ehresman [00:00:42]:
Hi there. Thanks for joining us. I'm Joanna Ehresman. And I'm Leah Alter. And this is WomenShare, a celebration of women in financial services.

Leah Alter [00:00:52]:
Today, we are lucky enough to be joined by Liz Hand, who is both an advisor and a mindset coach for advisors. Her firm, Pleasant Wealth, is based out of Canton, Ohio, and she is a 2nd generation financial planner. We are so excited today to dive into her newest endeavor as a mindset coach. She is passionate about supporting financial advisors through change with less self doubt and more life satisfaction. Love the sound of that. And she loves all the places money and mindset overlap. She launched a coaching practice where she impacts 100 of advisors by raising awareness to their self sabotage behaviors. We all have

Joanna Ehresman [00:01:37]:
those.

Leah Alter [00:01:38]:
And giving them tools to gain confidence and get into the flow of their life. We are just thrilled to have you on the show, Liz. Welcome to WomenShare.

Joanna Ehresman [00:01:48]:
Why, thank you. It's great

Liz Hand [00:01:49]:
to be here with you both.

Joanna Ehresman [00:01:50]:
Well and, Liz, I'm so excited to get to know you on the show today. We haven't met before, but any woman in the industry who has kind of blazed her own path or created kind of her unique combination of skills in her role is just someone where I'm automatically a fan of. So just really curious to hear what inspired you to become a mindset coach for advisors while also continuing to have your own practice?

Liz Hand [00:02:15]:
Yeah. I in the process of working on succession for the financial planning practice, My brother and I entered into a conversation with my dad, talking about the valuation, talking about how roles were going to change, all of those tactical details. And in the process, I received mindset coaching. And I recognized that the style of coaching was impacting me in pretty radical ways that were outside of just the container of that conversation. And so I was fascinated by it. And I asked my coach at the time, how did you get trained? Like, what is this? I want more of these types of conversations. And then I just followed the path, which usually is what happens for me as I kinda follow my curiosity, learn something new, and then try to integrate it into everything that I'm doing. And so that opened up some new doors and just recognizing how much we in the way that we relate to ourselves, we can limit ourselves, or we can really blaze a path and start something new.

Liz Hand [00:03:17]:
So it's exciting.

Joanna Ehresman [00:03:19]:
Well, that's a really cool experience. And what and did how did you as you started doing mindset work and, you know, getting some of the coaching training on your own, like, who is your first client? Your brother? Or how how did you expand? I'm like I'm like, I know how my brother would feel if I feel like

Liz Hand [00:03:36]:
No. They call that a conflict of interest.

Joanna Ehresman [00:03:38]:
No. Fair. Fair. Fair. Fair.

Liz Hand [00:03:41]:
No. Yeah. My first dabbles with having clients really were other advisors that I knew kind of had that desire. They had an exposure through a program limitless that I'm involved with, and they know how important mindset is. And so just practicing the skill set with them. Even some friends that are outside of my inner circle just to work the muscle and carry it

Leah Alter [00:04:06]:
forward. What are some of the themes that you hear that come up repeatedly for advisors, that you are working with. And what kind of techniques do you employ to help them overcome some of those mindset blocks or some of the big hurdles that you see kind of over and over again?

Liz Hand [00:04:25]:
The adviser circles that I run-in are typically really heart led people that are really want to do good in the world. Like, there's a whole span of the industry and different motivations, but I think within the financial planning world, that's that's really what you get is smart people that wanna make an impact and have a heart for their clients. Within that, there's this tendency that I see of being the overly responsible one in a relationship and how that translates to nearly every area of life. So not only do I want to be the helping and supporting my clients, I also want to do that for my family. I also want to do that in my faith community. I also want to do that in this organization that I volunteer for. And so what can happen for advisors is that you carry a ton of responsibility because you flex that muscle over and over and over. And really that's how you gain a sense of security in relationship with others or in in relationship and community.

Liz Hand [00:05:27]:
And that eventually hamstrings you. So

Leah Alter [00:05:31]:
Yeah. Yeah. It's it's sounding very I was gonna say it's sounding very codependent.

Liz Hand [00:05:37]:
Oh, that's interesting. Yeah.

Leah Alter [00:05:39]:
Right? Or or this idea of, like, I have to serve or be needed to feel like I'm bringing value to a relationship rather than, you know, just existing as a human, you bring a ton of value.

Liz Hand [00:05:52]:
Have you guys seen those, like, little TikTok clips where they talk about the friend that's the planner of the trip? Or

Joanna Ehresman [00:06:00]:
Yes. Yes.

Liz Hand [00:06:01]:
Like, to me, my guess is that if a lot of advisers end up being the planner of the fun thing, And sometimes that comes from a sense of delight and expansion, and sometimes they can experience, like, the sluggishness of it or the feeling like I have to do this. So maybe on one hand codependent, on the other hand, like it's where they really show their brilliance too.

Leah Alter [00:06:23]:
Yeah. Well, that's

Joanna Ehresman [00:06:24]:
an interesting thing to think about is when is it just leveraging your natural strengths versus, you know, something that becomes slightly not unhealthy. But, you know, like, it those warning signs of, like, oh, I'm starting to resent this or I'm regretting saying this. You know? It's like Right. What are some of those cues that some because I personally can identify as the person who just planned the cabin Olympics with my family. That's awesome. And I'm like I'm like, was I doing that because I was doing it because I I wanted more interaction and connection. There's more teenagers who are just you know, I wanna bring them out of their shells, but then also it was fun. Right? It didn't feel like a chore, but I could see how maybe 5 years in if I'm like, I'm still planning the cabin Olympics.

Joanna Ehresman [00:07:05]:
Right? But, like, how do you watch for watch for that? Is it just paying attention to those cues in your own like, does it bring you joy or not? Right?

Liz Hand [00:07:16]:
Right. Exactly. That just brought up Marie Kondo for me.

Joanna Ehresman [00:07:20]:
Yeah. It's gonna say joy.

Liz Hand [00:07:22]:
Exactly, though. I think when we pay attention to our own energy, our own real way that we're relating to the situation, it becomes pretty clear. Like, even people who don't wanna get into the emotive side of life and wanna stay pretty logical still can feel that feeling of sluggishness or, oh, yeah. This is kind of fun. This is this feels expansive. I'm sitting up. I'm I'm more at attention.

Leah Alter [00:07:48]:
Yeah. That makes sense. And and I think too, do you work with clients in terms of or or advisors in terms of recognizing some of those attributes in their clients as well? Because I would imagine once you start to learn some of these signs and have this awareness about yourself, you start to notice it, particularly with clients that might be struggling or or dealing with some of their own hurdles.

Liz Hand [00:08:17]:
Yeah. I don't know how you could avoid it. Once you become aware of patterns, that's the other thing is advisors are so keen for pattern recognition and solving for patterns that I don't know an advisor that can become self aware that doesn't also extend that into their practice. Which is one reason I'm so passionate about the work of mindset coaching within the advisor space is because I, I believe advisors can can affect so much change in someone's life.

Joanna Ehresman [00:08:46]:
Mhmm.

Liz Hand [00:08:47]:
Because money is is like blood in a body, like it connects all parts and its health matters. Therefore, the adviser that's taking care of the person with the money, if they're more self aware and they allow their client to become more self aware, then it's just allowing for family relationships to expand, community relationships to expand, the purpose of money to be less about consumerism and more about goodness. So I get really excited about all of the ripple effects for sure.

Joanna Ehresman [00:09:20]:
And as you're saying that, one question that came to mind, and this may be a leading question, but do you run into advisers it's almost like, compassion fatigue. I've heard of this of people working in the nonprofit space, right, where they have such a heart for what they do, but it can they take it home with them. Right? And I think it's really hard for an adviser who cares deeply about their clients and their financial situations to not if, you know, something isn't isn't going well or there's a concern to not bring that home with them. Have you run into any situations like that with some of the advisers you've coached or any advice for an adviser who may be grappling with that?

Liz Hand [00:09:55]:
What I saw in myself I'll just speak for myself, in that question. Yes. Absolutely. And there's only so much capacity of heart before you burn out. And in order to serve people, you need to come from a place of overflow to really have the exponential impact that you want. What I noticed, and it was so interesting the way I first saw it. I was in a coaching session and my coach was, like, telling me or reflecting back to me that there was a way I was uncomfortable with other people's discomfort. And then that I was stepping onto their side of the street to use that language to to make changes in places where I am making assertions, I'm making assumptions, and it's actually kind of arrogant.

Liz Hand [00:10:48]:
Yes. Liz is a compassionate person, but to take that much overstepping onto their side of the street can become, in a way, arrogant. And I was, like, annoyed with that. You know, it hit me too hard. I'm like, I'm not an arrogant person, but, then I like go and I go to get my lunch and I'm getting ready to eat it, and my thought there was, like, I think I'm gonna go to the green space here in Canton. They've got these new structures that are pretty cool. I'm just gonna look at it, eat my lunch. And so I parked in this place, and there's nobody else parked here.

Liz Hand [00:11:24]:
And I start to open my lunch and start to eat it. Just looking at this lovely setting, and this van pulls up, and they've got, like, a handicap sticker. And granted, there are, like, 20 parking spots, and I'm right next to the handicap parking spot. And so they try to back in. And here in Canton, we have these, like, back in diagonals, which are really tricky, and they're struggling. And I realized it took them about 3 seconds of struggle before I kicked on my the engine in my car and moved so that they could have the spot. That's a very small scenario, but that's that's me way overstepping and saying, like, you're you can't park, essentially. Or you can't like, I have to save the day on this in this very minor place, When really, I could have stayed put.

Liz Hand [00:12:16]:
They could have figured it out, or they could have made a different decision. When I accept that people are having the right experience, even when it's hard. Yes. And when I accept that all things are being redeemed even when they're hard, then I remove myself emotionally from not the compassion, but the, drama of it, which I think it's the drama that catches us and gives us fatigue, not the compassion.

Leah Alter [00:12:47]:
So Well, and it also, gives the other person this freedom and, like, past to just be where they are without feeling, awkward any more awkward or uncomfortable than they already are because you create the space for them where it's you're not needing them to change anything. Right? I I mean that practice just in my personal life, not even in my professional life, but even in my personal life has absolutely transformed relationships.

Liz Hand [00:13:23]:
Absolutely.

Leah Alter [00:13:24]:
It's a transformative practice. Thank you so much for bringing that to the show because I that's not something that's talked about very often.

Joanna Ehresman [00:13:35]:
No. I think I have a lot of self reflection to do based on No. I'm like, I think I'm arrogant. Oh my god. Okay. No. Like, great. But you know what I mean? Like but but I see what you're saying.

Joanna Ehresman [00:13:47]:
And I guess I've never it I haven't had the awareness to be like I think I'm being helpful. Right? But

Liz Hand [00:13:54]:
Right. And the invitation in that is to use arrogance only from the place of giving the other person freedom to act and be the way that they are, not a place of self flagellation. Like, we don't need other places to tell ourselves that we suck. We're pretty good at that already as human

Joanna Ehresman [00:14:12]:
beings. Right.

Leah Alter [00:14:14]:
Right. Yep. Right. Or or you're or even on the opposite of that, or that, like, you are being good or worthy of praise or whatever because you moved the parking spot or, you know, saved the day or whatever. Right? Like, it's it's both of those, which is, you know, we don't have anything to prove one way or another.

Joanna Ehresman [00:14:38]:
Mhmm.

Liz Hand [00:14:40]:
It's really shifted my understanding of my role as the adviser. Because on one hand, from an adviser perspective, we love to project out and find all the potential problems that are coming your way and solve for them. And that doesn't often get to the heart of what's needed in someone's finances for them to have a good felt satisfied life. So there's a way where, like, I don't even know how to fully say this. I don't think I've ever said it out loud, so watch me grapple with it. But, there's a way that I see this, like, long future time horizon that I used to go about the world with as my role of advisor of, like, I gotta look out way into the future, way to your retirement, way past your retirement, to your death, to your kids. Like, that's a really long way of me seeking to find anything that could go wrong. And there's goodness in that.

Liz Hand [00:15:45]:
In the coaching space, you accept that the person is not broken. That there's nothing to fix. It is just a place for you to, listen and reflect, listen and reflect. Ask questions that make them more curious about themselves, listen, reflect. And so it's very present moment oriented. And I've noticed that as I have deployed that skill set more and more with clients, the conversation goes a lot deeper. But also, I kind of bring that time horizon in a little bit more because I'm willing to accept that there is so much uncertainty in between. That even though I see that thing out at age 83, it doesn't it's not real.

Liz Hand [00:16:29]:
And so can I just look in the present moment, stay with a client, look at the next great step? Solve for that, understanding the full context of a financial advisor and the tax implications and the withdrawal rates and and and and, that has messed with my mind, needless to say.

Joanna Ehresman [00:16:47]:
Well and I wonder, though, for clients, like, stepping into a client's shoes, I think that's probably a lot more reassuring. Right? Because I think sometimes the projections in the long term and, oh, you have an 87%, you know, confidence rate that you're gonna not run out of like, it's like, that's great, but I'm still kinda nervous. Right? Like, versus if you feel like your adviser is also looking more near term and what really matters and, like, to you now and where you wanna be in the next few years. It's a little bit it feels, like, more relevant, you know, for the client then. Mhmm.

Leah Alter [00:17:26]:
Well, and particularly for for for younger clients. Right? Like, the the those that are not about to retire. Right? So if you're working with folks that are in their forties, thirties, forties, even, like, early fifties, that's probably really reassuring to them to have someone who's understanding what they want to accomplish now or in the next 5 years versus what the end of their life looks like.

Liz Hand [00:17:55]:
Mhmm. Well, even with retirees, which that's predominantly the client base that we serve and continue to, it's like we're ringing a bell and it's drawing women who are in that space of retirement alone, whether by choice or, happenstance, essentially. And that place of being willing to hang out in the discomfort of what's happening today, I don't think women, which the average age of widowhood is, like, 59. Mhmm. If you think about the average retirement, that's 65 maybe. I don't know. I don't know the exact numbers on that. Some some adviser can fact check me.

Liz Hand [00:18:38]:
But if if you think about that, you're entering one of the most chaotic feeling times financially from the retirement perspective because you're exchanging, like, I'm no longer going to work for a paycheck. I'm going to just let this account that I've built pay me this paycheck. So you've got that discomfort with grief.

Leah Alter [00:18:59]:
Right.

Liz Hand [00:19:00]:
And sometimes that grief is someone just leaving their their career and and reforming their identity and really figuring out who they are in the next stretch of time. Sometimes that's someone who's dealt with a spouse passing away and has no idea what to do with money, do the money thing, but then also the grief. So me projecting way out into the future may be supportive, and maybe that's the thing that solves for the feeling of anxiety in the moment or more likely staying more present, solves for that.

Joanna Ehresman [00:19:32]:
Man, I'm like I know. I'm like, there's so much okay. We could keep going on this. Oh, but I do wanna okay. Really loved following what you're doing on social media. So I'm taking this in a lighter slightly lighter direction. Sure. So for I would just love to hear a little bit more about how you approach social media.

Joanna Ehresman [00:19:58]:
So for a listener who maybe hasn't come across your profile yet, give us a quick overview of of your style and approach, and how have you seen that affect your business?

Liz Hand [00:20:07]:
Mhmm. Couple different ways that it's iterated over time, but the most succinct way is lighthearted and straight to the heart. That's how I view the way I show up online. So I do it started with video. I really enjoy the process of just being on video, explaining a concept, really punchy. But I like to do it from a lighthearted perspective. Maybe throw crack a couple of jokes in there, and not be so technical or it's it's not as much. It is information, but it's not from the lens that of, like, nerdy information.

Liz Hand [00:20:43]:
It is through the lens of connecting information. That's kind of my style. And so I try to keep the videos really short, and I've built a YouTube channel. I repost that onto LinkedIn. And what I found is that I also on Facebook. I've got a community of women on Facebook.

Joanna Ehresman [00:21:02]:
Okay. I was gonna say Facebook. Yeah. Okay.

Liz Hand [00:21:06]:
Each of those placements give me different connections. So when I'm posting on YouTube, it's, to me, that's like me giving back to the community at large, the community being the world, in that it's easily accessible information for someone who feels like they're starting from scratch, don't know anything about investments, number 1. In the Facebook realm, in my private financial my private community for women, It opens up conversation in a way where they can ask questions if they desire to, or they can just consume, but not with any pressure. And I also can use a lot of, like, more emotive ways of connecting. It's more of a feminine approach. In LinkedIn, it has ended up, generating a lot of conversation with other advisors. And the which is fun for me because I I love connecting with other advisors. But the other piece that I've started in the last couple of years is this blog style writing, which is very it's it is mindset, and it's all the awareness that I've had and projecting it on other people.

Liz Hand [00:22:20]:
And so I write from a way of, like, you feel this way, you thought it was this, it's actually this. And that has been so fun for me because I get these messages behind the wall or sometimes if someone's bold enough in the comment section, and it's like, you just nailed me, Liz. I totally resonated with that. So that's that's the approach that I use.

Leah Alter [00:22:45]:
And it feels like so if you are following Liz, that will all be in the show notes and you'll have links to everything, to to get in touch with her. But it feels so vulnerable and personal and authentic as a viewer. And I, you know, I think that that is a piece in this industry that we don't see a whole lot, especially from advisors, who might be, like, worried about their appearance or, you know, how their clients might view them or prospects or whatever. But it is so refreshing and relatable to be able to hear your stories and your experiences. So I'm glad you're getting that kind of feedback.

Liz Hand [00:23:38]:
Mhmm. What's fascinating to me, it it just kind of shows too, like personality or being state. People tell me that it is vulnerable, and it doesn't feel vulnerable to me for what it's worth. Like, just recognize that in that there's fish don't know the water that they swim in and there, there's other water out there. So for the advisor that hears that and says, like, I couldn't be that vulnerable, you could, and it actually could support your business.

Leah Alter [00:24:07]:
Well, and and it's it goes back to that concept of, like, the right people Mhmm. Who want to work with you, it will resonate and connect with, and those are those are your people. Those are your clients. Mhmm. Those that, like, don't get it or don't connect with you aren't for you, and that's okay too. Mhmm.

Liz Hand [00:24:27]:
The idea of being a station on the radio that people can tune into, And if if it's not right for you, it sounds staticky and fuzzy and you won't get it, you won't like it, whatever, you won't act on it for sure. That resonates for me. And just like I can be full out me, exactly the way that I am. When it lands, it's a ring it's it's a ringing bell. It is a clear station. It is heard, understood, and acted on. So

Joanna Ehresman [00:24:56]:
I love that. Yes.

Leah Alter [00:24:59]:
So we ask, Liz, every guest that comes on the show, what is the best career advice that you have ever received?

Liz Hand [00:25:09]:
That's a great question.

Leah Alter [00:25:12]:
Or one of the best.

Liz Hand [00:25:15]:
So I know this is not your question, but since,

Leah Alter [00:25:19]:
This is your show.

Liz Hand [00:25:20]:
I was gonna say, this is my show and you can't control me. You could go because you could totally cut this out. But my mind immediately went to the worst information, which I know is not what you asked. So the worst career advice I got.

Joanna Ehresman [00:25:33]:
Yeah.

Liz Hand [00:25:34]:
For someone who is so authenticity driven, I was given advice when I was younger that I just looked so young. I looked so young. Can you make yourself look different? So try the lipstick, try the makeup a different way, fill in your eyebrows, wear glasses, and for some people that works and that boosts their confidence. For me, it like, I could almost be in tears. The first time someone put lipstick on me okay. I come from a Mennonite Amish background, and makeup is not highly, it's not a big value in that community. So

Joanna Ehresman [00:26:09]:
Yeah.

Liz Hand [00:26:10]:
I know. The idea of, like, really bold lipstick. Oh, I was basically in tears looking at myself. Like, I can't do this. Who would it be? You know? For those who are authentic more authenticity driven, There's no that fake it to make it model, I don't think that's the approach. But trusting yourself and learning how to build that trust in different ways, so it's not like appearance driven, is really important.

Joanna Ehresman [00:26:41]:
It's true. I mean, it it just continues. Leah, I I feel like some of these same experiences, not necessarily that exact experience of, like, you know, change your your appearance to look older, but those themes of trusting yourself and just leaning into authenticity. Like, I don't know. Again, maybe it's selection bias because of the guests we have on the show, but I it seems to work. Right? Like that these successful women have built these practices and careers that, are based on this authenticity.

Leah Alter [00:27:14]:
Well, and I think a lot of the women that we've had on the show or just people that I know and have had conversations with my own experience as well is, like, we've all been kind of given that advice of, like, you're great, but if you could just do this or change this or show up this way. And, you know, at some point, we probably have all tried it and then, yeah, felt not good about it. Mhmm. It's it's not,

Joanna Ehresman [00:27:40]:
it doesn't

Leah Alter [00:27:40]:
serve us, and that ultimately means it's not serving our clients or whoever we're working with and for in the long run.

Joanna Ehresman [00:27:53]:
Mhmm.

Liz Hand [00:27:54]:
Yeah. It strikes me, you know, you said selection bias and you interview women and the the process of trusting yourself is the feminine heroine's journey. Right? Like, going into the depths and understanding self and learning to trust self as to become the hero of your own life. So it makes sense that it would pop up.

Leah Alter [00:28:17]:
From Maiden to Mother.

Liz Hand [00:28:19]:
Good book. Have you read it?

Leah Alter [00:28:21]:
Yeah. It's great.

Joanna Ehresman [00:28:25]:
I'm like I'm like, Leah, this is not like, woah. Woah. No. No, I love it. It's okay.

Liz Hand [00:28:30]:
This is this is my recent thing.

Joanna Ehresman [00:28:32]:
I love it. Yeah. It's back. Go there.

Leah Alter [00:28:34]:
Do it.

Liz Hand [00:28:34]:
The word woo woo, people bring this up. Will, you know, that is just in general people's discomfort with intuition because

Leah Alter [00:28:44]:
you can't

Liz Hand [00:28:45]:
data driven understand intuition from the same lens of information that they can other things in life. And so they label it woo, and it is just as tangible as data. Yeah. In my humble opinion.

Leah Alter [00:29:03]:
I agree. A skill that or a muscle like you referenced at the beginning of the show, it's just a muscle that you have to train and learn. Especially as women, we are trained and learned to ignore it so that we can, you know, politely fit into society. So we you know, it's our our own journey of learning how to go inside and tap into it, but that information is definitely powerful and is definitely accessible. Yeah.

Joanna Ehresman [00:29:38]:
Liz, outside of your career and all that you're doing as an advisor and mindset coach, what else can we celebrate with you today?

Liz Hand [00:29:45]:
What can you celebrate with me?

Joanna Ehresman [00:29:47]:
Yeah.

Liz Hand [00:29:50]:
I am stepping out into the unknown of writing a book, blending the two realms of mindset and money. I don't know when it'll come out, but I've been testing the concepts of it. And it's landing for people, which is cool. And so just continuing to practice, like, you guys have heard maybe you have, maybe you haven't. Carl Richards talks about dancing with the dragons, and, like, I'm pretty rattled. I feel like I'm dancing with the dragons because it's just on the edge of my comfort zone. And as he says, that's where the treasure lies. So, I'm just trusting this is where the treasure lies.

Liz Hand [00:30:30]:
So that's what you can celebrate with me.

Leah Alter [00:30:32]:
Oh, Absolutely celebrating that.

Joanna Ehresman [00:30:34]:
Yes. Congratulations.

Leah Alter [00:30:36]:
That was a big theme for us when we started the podcast, particularly for, for Joanna. This was way outside of her comfort zone. We put, you know, she was pushed and, she has certainly risen to the occasion and beyond. So, all the good stuff lies on the other side of that comfort zone for sure. Well, Liz, this has just been such an amazing conversation. Thank you so much for being here and sharing your wisdom, your story, your advice. I think it's going to be a very powerful, message for our listeners. So thank you so much for being here.

Liz Hand [00:31:12]:
You're quite welcome. It was a real pleasure.

Joanna Ehresman [00:31:16]:
Thanks. And that's our show for today. So if ours is a mission that you would like to share in, please subscribe to WomenShare on your favorite podcast platform. With that, I'm Joanna Erisman. And I'm Leah Alter,

Leah Alter [00:31:28]:
and we will catch you on the next episode of WomenShare.